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Do you really think that Coalition MPs are going to bring down the government? They would be massacred at any general election. And the Labour party couldn't finance a GE any time in the near future. There will be a lot of huffing and puffing and it won't matter at all.

backofanenvelope wrote:-
"They would be massacred at any general election. And the Labour party couldn't finance a GE any time in the near future."
And this would be bad because..........?
We have a government that everyone is complaining about, "no mandate", "I didn't vote for that" etc. A bill that is trying to do too much at once, introduce a "PR" voting system that favours the status quo, and a new method of defining constituency size and area, that a large proportion of the UK seems uncomfortable with, and looks like, according to other party's and a large number of political pundits, it was only introduced to ensure that 1 party benefited, in short, gerrymandered.
All in all, a general election, with the promise of a new government, may not be that bad a thing.

Well, it might be better to have two acts of parliament - one for equalising electorates and another for changing the voting system - or not changing it. I would have preferred a constitutional assembly to consider all the various voting systems and then put the options to the electorate. Fat chance of that.

Equalising the electoral size of each parliamentary seat seems quite just to me. Perhaps Cornwall should just have 5 slightly oversize constituencies.

I like your suggestion that we might get a new government - new in what sense? It would be Labour, Conservative or LibDem or some combination of same.

"And a new method of defining constituency size and area, that a large proportion of the UK seems uncomfortable"

That is errant nonsense,, P_Trembath.

500 people turning up at Saltash and...

Where else, exactly?

backofanenvelope wrote:-
"Well, it might be better to have two acts of parliament - one for equalising electorates and another for changing the voting system - or not changing it. I would have preferred a constitutional assembly to consider all the various voting systems and then put the options to the electorate. Fat chance of that."
And run the risk of having a true PR system, and not one that favours the status quo, you've got it right, fat chance.

backofanenvelope wrote:-
"Equalising the electoral size of each parliamentary seat seems quite just to me. Perhaps Cornwall should just have 5 slightly oversize constituencies."
Equal within limits. However, the council have said that if every household actually registered , then the probability is that Cornwall may well be eligible for 6, but there is a possibility that the second home issue may well bring that back down. In short, apart from changing just the voting system we should be looking to re-vamp the whole electoral system.
In my opinion, registration should be compulsory and voting should be compulsory. (All polls should also have a "none of the above" option) Combine that with a reasonable PR system, and we would be well on the road to getting things right.

backofanenvelope wrote:-
"I like your suggestion that we might get a new government - new in what sense? It would be Labour, Conservative or LibDem or some combination of same."
New in the sense that it had just been elected, as for what colour it would be? Just so long as it is able to form a government that all can get behind. Another "fat chance" maybe?

A bit of math would sort this one out. There are 3 Tory MP's in the county of Cornwall. If 61 Tory MP's are rebelling then I'm sure that "Devonwall" will not be the reason this bill fails.

However I'm sure some in the loony within the nationalist clique will claim it to be so.

I'm sure the fraud perpetrated on the people of Cornwall, by those devious and underhand nationalists, that this is something to do with "Changing Cornwall's boundaries" will be again hoisted and nailed to the mast.

I'm sure that the Celtic League and Mebyon Kernow and The Stannary Lot will all claim that they had some part in the downfall of the bill, and that it was an expression of the desire for "a Cornish Nation".

When you have people who express extremist views like; "I do what I do for Kernow, for her peoples, for true democracy, for freedom and to fight the uncaring axis of evil in London in the Country next door," (Mike Chappell allegedly) then how can truth and common sense prevail?

It is always advisable not to post after a night in the pub.

"Just so long as it is able to form a government that all can get behind"

The coalition government got about two thirds of the vote. In Cornwall it took all six seats. So it shouldn't be too difficult for everyone to get behind it.

As far as making registration and voting compulsory; fair enough. Then we could locate all those people who are not paying council tax and introduce a sort of head tax - we could call it the poll tax! Cornwall council could probably avoid all the planned cuts.

bckofanenvelope wrote:-
"The coalition government got about two thirds of the vote. In Cornwall it took all six seats. So it shouldn't be too difficult for everyone to get behind it."
And yet, how often do we hear the complaint that no-one voted for a coalition, etc?
We have a "first past the post" electoral system, and people have come to expect this to provide an overall winner, they are told they are, and they expect to be , voting form the party they want to represent them. As no-one voted for a coalition, there are many who feel cheated, supporters from all political parties. Those who voted Tory did not expect Lib Dem ministers in government, and vica versa, those who voted Labour, feel that the Tory- Lib Dem coalition is a false construct set up to keep them out of power. A "new" election, resulting in a "new" government, could well be a good thing.

bckofanenvelope wrote:-
"As far as making registration and voting compulsory; fair enough. Then we could locate all those people who are not paying council tax and introduce a sort of head tax - we could call it the poll tax! Cornwall council could probably avoid all the planned cuts."
In principle, a "Poll tax" is a very good idea, as long as it is run in conjunction with a property tax, and there is provision for those who are genuinely unable to pay. I see nothing wrong with ALL chipping in for the benefits that ALL receive. As to whether such a taxation system would provide the extra funds required to avoid Cornwall Council's planned cuts, would depend on how such tax was set up. But, I would be willing to bet that any extra money raised in this way would be cut from the money that the Council receive from the government, back to square one.
The "poll tax" failed last time, in large part, because a lot of households ended up paying a lot more than they had the previous year. If applied fairly, along with a property tax, and maybe even a local income tax, then, provided they found a new name for it, I think that it could be the most effective and, above all fair, means of raising local Council funds.

If you google (news) Devonwall the only papers mentioning it are those based in the west, this is not news and as the fruit bats are the only ones shouting about it, it is unlikely to make serious headlines. A Cornish molehill rather than a tor

The poll tax failed last time because a lot of people who didn't pay rates suddenly found they had to pay the poll tax. These people are also the people who believe in money trees.

"The poll tax failed last time because a lot of people who didn't pay rates suddenly found they had to pay the poll tax."

Where do you get this stuff, backofanenvelope ?

The Poll Tax was unfair, unjust and withdrawn as soon as the politicians realised the facts.

It was "tested" in Scotland.At that time there was perhaps one Conservative seat in Scotland. The Tories had nothing to lose, or so they thought.
They learned, to their cost, that the electorate and the Tory grandees, had had their fill of Thatcherism.

backofanenvelope wrote:-
"The poll tax failed last time because a lot of people who didn't pay rates suddenly found they had to pay the poll tax."
Partly, it also failed because all of a sudden , households were finding that they now had bills that were twice. three times, or even larger than they were paying before.
No thought had gone into a transitional period, or into the fairness of how the tax was to be implemented. In short, the way it was implemented, there were more "losers" than "winners".

Yeah, whatever Gaz!

"Where do you get this stuff, backofanenvelope ?"

I do the same you do - I make it up!

Really?

Don't give up your day job.

Andrew George MP has just said: "All I am asking the Government to do is to let Cornwall decide where its border is. We are not asking for more favourable treatment than anywhere else. Indeed, we are even prepared to give up half a Parliamentary seat to be used elsewhere."


Who elected the MP from the far west of Cornwall to speak for us here in the east? It's not his bloody seat he's offering to give up half of!

Typical of Andrew George, wanting to play to the nationalists, who's votes keep him on the gravy train.

At least he didn't have the gall to promote the lie that this about changing the border of Cornwall.

"... Andrew George MP has just said: "All I am asking the Government to do is to let Cornwall decide.."

Cornwall was very vocal by there absence in Saltash recently

Andrew is MK through and through but realised he would end up old and poor if kept running with the nats, must credit him with more logic than the normal nutters starving to death

SG鈥�.If you google (news) Devonwall the only papers mentioning

Well I just searched devonwall on google news and found only one link to a national paper, perhaps these instructions were too complicated for Trembath! (see rant above)

This is the only link I found



鈥�.Joachim von Ribbentrop, Adolf Hitler鈥檚 foreign minister, fancied retiring to Cornwall after a German invasion of Britain 鈥� an astute choice, even before Rick Stein livened up the county鈥檚 cuisine. After a visit to Cornwall in 1937, when he was ambassador to Britain, von Ribbentrop apparently had his eye on St Michael鈥檚 Mount, a picturesque tidal island, and Tregenna Castle near St Ives.
Therefore it is safe to confirm it is not a national story in fact it remains a joke as the next but one paragraph confirms

鈥�..We do know what David Cameron thinks, though. In an unguarded remark before an ITV interview last week, the prime minister said: 鈥淚t鈥檚 the Tamar, not the Amazon, for heaven鈥檚 sake.鈥� The Devonwall notion arises from the government鈥檚 plan to create constituencies of more equal size. Protesters say it would violate a border that has stood for more than 1,000 years since a treaty between King Athelstan of Wessex and King Hywel of Cornwall

The links I provided are from "National" papers, I got them by using Google, in fact I used the very words that "Gary" suggested.
One can only draw ones own conclusions as to how you were "unable" to find them.
(Mind you, Gary claimed that it was ONLY local papers that mentioned it, ouch, own goal!)

Let's read what Gary said

"鈥f you google (news) Devonwall鈥�"

It clearly says news. Really no comment it's just like junior school, most just ignore it.

I believe Joachim von Ribbentrop fell in love with St Ives, not hard to see why, I wonder if a couple of his staff officers took his tickets. It would explain so much

My previous comments stand.

Moderators, house rules state:-
"We reserve the right to fail messages which are considered likely to disrupt, provoke, attack or offend others."
The 麻豆官网首页入口 "Terms of Use" state:-
"No disruptive, offensive or abusive behaviour: contributions must be constructive and polite, not mean-spirited or contributed with the intention of causing trouble."
And yet, the above post contains the following sentences:-
"I believe Joachim von Ribbentrop fell in love with St Ives, not hard to see why, I wonder if a couple of his staff officers took his tickets. It would explain so much"
One wonders how such a comment is not "likely to provoke", is not "likely to offend others". How it can be said to be "constructive and polite", and "not mean-spirited". To what extent it was not posted with the "intention of causing trouble"?

Judge for yourself Claire, fact remains the nationals laugh at this when they cover it, the only people having a tantrum about this are the nat nuts, who make "ALL" Cornish look like them