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That pesky family tree ...
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Message 1.Â
Posted by Arkwright Hall (U8718267) on Tuesday, 22nd March 2011
So, I went to the family tree to see which of Jack or Phil was the elder son of Dan & Doris.
I discover they were twins - both born on 1st Jan 1970, the same day as both their father and mother. And Tracey Horrobin. And Lucas and Sipho. And many others. Busy day in maternity, that was,
I also see that Dan Archer's occupation is unknown, and I can help here - I think you'll find he was a farmer?
Please can the data be added to the family tree, to make it more useful?
Meanwhile, does anyone recall if Jack Archer was older than Phil? I am checking that Tony is the head of the clan now, as the elder son of the elder son of Dan & Doris?
Of course, in these gender-equal enlightened times, first-born Jenny is the matriarch of the family which everyone should look up to and respect. On your knees, Brian! -
Message 2
Posted by Seveek (U13636812) on Tuesday, 22nd March 2011
I am unsure where you are going with the matriarch and head of the clan business but I think this is a list of the main Archers which includes Jack, the older brother, and Phil. I have two dates for Grace’s DoB and no death date for Ben but possibly WWI.
The list may contain errors depending on the source and my transposition.
Archer, Daniel, Dan, DoB 15/10/1896. Age Now 114.43. Died 26-Apr-86. Age when died 89.52
Archer, John Benjamin (Ben), DoB 27/5/1898. Age Now 112.81. Died ?
Archer, Frank, DoB 1-Jun-00. Age Now 110.80. Died 30-May-57. Age when died 56.99
Archer, Doris, DoB 11-Jul-00. Age Now 110.69. Died 27-Oct-80. Age when died 80.30
Archer, Jack, DoB 17-Dec-22. Age Now 88.26. Died 11-Jan-72. Age when died 49.07
Archer, Philip Walter, DoB 23-Apr-28. Age Now 82.91. Died 12-Feb-10. Age when died 81.81
Archer, Grace, DoB 2-Apr-29. Age Now 81.97. Died 22-Sep-55. Age when died 26.47
Archer, Grace, DoB 28-Sep-30. Age Now 80.48. Died 22-Sep-55. Age when died 24.98
Archer, Jill, DoB 3-Oct-30. Age Now 80.47
Archer, Christine, DoB 21-Dec-31. Age Now 79.25
Archer, Jennifer, DoB 7-Jan-45. Age Now 66.20
Archer, Lilian, DoB 8-Jul-47. Age Now 63.70
Archer, Anthony William Daniel, DoB 16-Feb-51. Age Now 60.09
Archer, Kenton, DoB 8-Aug-58. Age Now 52.62
Archer, Shula, DoB 8-Aug-58. Age Now 52.62
Archer, Elizabeth, DoB 21-Apr-67. Age Now 43.92
Archer, Ruth, DoB 16-Jun-68. Age Now 42.76
Archer, John, DoB 31-Dec-75. Age Now 35.22. Died 25-Feb-98. Age when died 22.15
Archer, Helen, DoB 16-Apr-79. Age Now 31.93
Archer, Tommy, DoB 25-Feb-81. Age Now 30.07
Archer, Pip, DoB 17-Feb-93. Age Now 18.09
Archer, Josh, DoB 13-Sep-97. Age Now 13.52 -
Message 3
Posted by My Mum is turning in her grave (U13137565) on Tuesday, 22nd March 2011
I thought Dan was the second son but don't have any dates to substantiaite this.
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Message 4
Posted by Sallyruth (U14589711) on Tuesday, 22nd March 2011
Daniel (1896 - 1986)
Frank (1900 - 1957)
John Banjamin (1898 - 1972)
from
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Message 5
Posted by Arkwright Hall (U8718267) on Wednesday, 23rd March 2011
Thank you all!
So on the principle of firstborn:
Dan begat Jack
Jack begat Jennifer
Jennifer begat Adam
... so I guess that line runs out at that point.
Under the iniquitous male-only principle, we would have:
Dan begat Jack
Jack begat Anthony
Anthony begat John
John (and Sharon) begat a son, I hope!
Dopey Dave had better get ready to hand over Brookfield to its rightful owner!! -
Message 6
Posted by My Mum is turning in her grave (U13137565) on Wednesday, 23rd March 2011
"Dopey Dave had better get ready to hand over Brookfield to its rightful owner!!"
Why? Jack wasn't interested in Brookfield, that's why Phil inherited. Similarly with Kenton and Dave. I have high hopes that Pip will lose interest or go abroad and Josh or Ben will take over when the time comes. Although I'm unlikely to be still listening when it happens. -
Message 7
Posted by Arkwright Hall (U8718267) on Wednesday, 23rd March 2011
Oh, Mum, don't let mundane facts get in the way of mischievious stirring!!
I know that Dan (assuming I am right in recalling him to be a farmer) or Phil could have given Brookfield to anyone they chose, e.g. the second son who was interested.
Maybe a future plot line could find Dan's old will giving his entire estate to the Nuns of Prestatyn ...
This thread started as a move towards questioning whether Dave was the "head of the clan", as he is being portrayed. We have established that the oldest living firstborn is Jennifer, and the mantle passes to Tony when she moves on. -
Message 8
Posted by My Mum is turning in her grave (U13137565) on Wednesday, 23rd March 2011
Tony has always suffered from being the baby of his branch of the family. Sadly JD, the rightful heir to the mantle of clan leader, suffers from lack of vertebrae. Lilian will do anything for a G&T or a smile from Tiger. Kenton has other things on his mind although it looks as though we may see an Archer back behind the bar in the Bull. I wonder what Peggy will think?
So all in all my candidate for (male) leader is Daniel. -
Message 9
Posted by Reggie Trentham (U2746099) on Wednesday, 23rd March 2011
I have high hopes that Pip will lose interest or go abroad and Josh or Ben will take over when the time comes.Â
I think that will have to happen. If it doesn't then, in fifty or so years time when Pip hands over the reins to an offspring, it quiite probably won't have the Archer surname. Brookfield will no longer have an Archer at the helm and they'll have to change the name of the programme.
I won't be around to listen then either. -
Message 10
Posted by Peggy Monahan (U2254875) on Monday, 28th March 2011
Why should Pip change her name?
I think the head of the clan role comes with being Boss at Brookfield. -
Message 11
Posted by Reggie Trentham (U2746099) on Monday, 28th March 2011
Why should Pip change her name?Â
No reason at all why she should, but in all likelyhood any children she has will take their father's name. So unless she marries/shacks up with someone called Archer Brookfield will pass out of Archer hands. -
Message 12
Posted by Peggy Monahan (U2254875) on Monday, 28th March 2011
No reason at all why she should, but in all likelyhood any children she has will take their father's name.Â
She could be a single mother in a variety of different ways, not just like Helen, so I don't see it's a given. In fact it could be rather a good story line (not if it's a Helen rerun of course). -
Message 13
Posted by shulascat (U14737252) on Friday, 8th April 2011
I expect Pip to take over eventually as the first female Head of Brookfield, as it would be the Politically Correct thing for the SWs to do. It would be perfectly reasonable to keep the Archer name if she got married, but I predict she will not get married but live there with a partner. As she seems to go for older men I wonder whether this is the eventual reason for Harry, though, after her past experience she might prefer a female partner.
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