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who picked Berryfields
This discussion has been closed.
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Message 1.Â
Posted by hounded (U7956325) on Friday, 20th April 2007
Monty the "yawn" just said that Berryfields was a very cold spot and that the spring bedding was just "getting going".And then said to vist a garden that is in full swing for bedding. Now looking at GW tonight , and its bare trees it was either filmed ages ago, or indeed is way behind much of the UK, where hawthorns is flowering a month early. If so why pick a garden which in Monty's own words is "cold for the next month" when many of our gardens are well ahead, as an advice programme whats the point if the information is so far behind the growing timetable for many of us. The spring bedding in cold damp north Holland is almost going over, my own garden has rose/ clematis /geum/ and last sundays I picked 6 early strawberrys. surely it would have been better to film in a more average place. For me its is why GW in its present form just is not working along with its well meaming but dull presenters not open to change. as the micro herb tasting and Montys and Joes comments showed.
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Message 2
Posted by fhionnaidh (U8121259) on Sunday, 22nd April 2007
living in the north of scotland i find that berryfields is coming along at about the same rate as our plants and trees up here so find it extremely useful to follow being a relative newcomer to gardening. up here we say that for every plant in england starting to flower,wait a month for us to catch up! but i hear what you are saying. maybe a bit more general info for around the country would be handy and ideas of different rates of growth for differnt areas as well so that people like myself dont panic, for example, when told that seedlings of a plant variety should be pricked out and mine are just starting to show through the soil!
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Message 3
Posted by hounded (U7956325) on Sunday, 22nd April 2007
I totaly agree with you, a regional forcast and planting area advice would be great,perhaps links to gardens in Scotland Wales and Ireland. But the fact remains that most of the population is in the south east corner of the uk, where most people are well head of Montys patch.
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Message 4
Posted by babylemonade (U8169184) on Sunday, 22nd April 2007
In East Anglia we find if we go a mere 15 miles into Cambridge, all the gardens are 3 weeks ahead of us, because it's a town and therefore a few degrees warmer. There are areas in our 2 acre garden that at this time of year, depending on how exposed, or the aspect, vary by a couple of degrees as well.
It would be impossible to fine tune what is supposed to be a national gardening programme to cover everybody's situation. And as for the South East, Kent and Essex had more snow than we did this winter, even though we're farther north. -
Message 5
Posted by Yakram (U2443370) on Monday, 23rd April 2007
Anyone found the co-ordinates for this 'fantasy' garden yet?
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Message 6
Posted by hounded (U7956325) on Tuesday, 24th April 2007
yes this winter south east had snow, but if you looked at the average temp for the past month it is above 20C so why did the GW garden look like the bloody actic in mid winter?
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Message 7
Posted by groovygran (U2934690) on Wednesday, 25th April 2007
I lived in the SE for the bulk of my life, and certainly the winter was colder there than here in the East Midlands. We also had far more/deeper snow than my son had in Macclesfield. I understood it was something to do with the 'bulge' of that area, coastline not topography! Doesn't the same apply to East Anglia?
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Message 8
Posted by Seacarrot (U3012141) on Wednesday, 25th April 2007
Berryfields is in Warwickshire.
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Message 9
Posted by groovygran (U2934690) on Thursday, 26th April 2007
kfgray - are you sure that it's hawthorn in blossom? My hawthorn is only just showing green leaves. Are you sure you're not getting mixed up with blackthorn which is now in full glory? Hawthorn leaves appear before the blossom, blackthorn flowers on bare black branches.
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Message 10
Posted by cazsudz (U7061972) on Thursday, 26th April 2007
Hawthorn is definitely out up here in South Yorks. It was even on radio 4 the other day that the May blossom is out early
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Message 11
Posted by auricula (U3244275) on Thursday, 26th April 2007
Hawthorne is out here too.
I think it would be helpful if on GW they showed us a large plan of Berryfields. That way we would have some idea of the different elements in relationship to each other, and also see where they're working. -
Message 12
Posted by Jenks812 (U5452843) on Thursday, 26th April 2007
auricula,
this may not be as good as seeing it in the flesh but it does give one a good idea of where certain parts of the garden relate to others.
i remember AT did a bit on GW ( I think he did it twice) where he did one long shot of him taking a walk through the entire garden. it was a pretty good idea.
i remember they did a big walk through berryfields when they first started there and talked about the ideas of the garden but i don't remember them having done it since. wouldn't be that bad an idea to do it once a year of something.
but then again, I don't think Berryfields is designed for being one big cohesive garden. more a bunch of little gardens put together. -
Message 13
Posted by Slugger (U2316506) on Thursday, 26th April 2007
Just on the off chance I've just been onto google Earth and entered Berryfields, Warwickshire, England, and it came up in the village of Fillongly, just off the M6.
Can any local residents there confirm or otherwise that this is our Berryfields?
I did suspect that it was a fictitious name, but you never know...... -
Message 14
Posted by auricula (U3244275) on Thursday, 26th April 2007
Thanks Jenks - much appreciated
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Message 15
Posted by hounded (U7956325) on Thursday, 26th April 2007
Sure sure super sure ,Â鶹¹ÙÍøÊ×Ò³Èë¿Ú morning news even had a spot about it. And Kew confirmed
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Message 16
Posted by Slugger (U2316506) on Thursday, 26th April 2007
Yes, it was definitely hawthorn; Swifts too! Everything is early - the best part of the year about to erupt and I'll be in the States for a week. Working.
Ah well, there's always next year. I hope. If we're spared. -
Message 17
Posted by mr naughty corner (U2456974) on Thursday, 26th April 2007
It was actually me who picked Berryfields- I'm sorry I'm sorry I'm sorry!
I tried to get an omnipresent garden for the show- does anyone know of any? My concern was that this could cause religious hatred and wars between cults if we were to find that, perhaps, the Buddha had a better omnipresent garden than say Vishnu (personally, I would expect Vishnu's to be the best kept garden, but I would imagine that Buddha would keep a good lawn)- and what if some of the Egyptian Gods wanted in on the act? I've always thought that dog headed hard looking one Anubis would be a bit handy if it came to a scrap? I wouldn't want to be the one to diss his vegetable patch!
Your question is valid, but, before we start an inter-deity sub-galactic unholy conflict that may shatter the very fabric of time unleashing all kinds of stuff onto our streets that we really don't want (such as plagues and hungry dinosaurs) and leave us all wishing we'd just been happy with our lot- lets just all calm down a bit!
Derek Pig -
Message 18
Posted by hounded (U7956325) on Friday, 27th April 2007
hello mr Pig what do you grow in your garden? And do you think you may be smoking to much of it? Happy gardening
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Message 19
Posted by CycadPariah (U8165600) on Friday, 27th April 2007
Mr Pig,
I take issue with you that you believe that Vishnu's omnipresent garden would be better than Buddha's.
As a committed and practising Buddhist I think your treading on very shaky ground. I think you are already in danger of starting a inter-deity conflict as you call it. However I haven't seen any dinosaurs yet.
So just watch it! -
Message 20
Posted by mr naughty corner (U2456974) on Wednesday, 2nd May 2007
Sorry CycadPariah...(...?...)
if nothing else, your message board name has confused me and i bow before your Buddhist-ness.
Oh great one.
What about the athiest garden? What would he grow in that? If there is no god in that garden and therefore no head gardener, will it just descend into anarchy? What would the standard of horticulture be like without organised religion? Is it just a coincidence that Alan Titchmarsh used to present 'Songs of Praise"?
And Satan. Apart from the obvious red hot pokers, what's he going to grow in his garden? I expect he'd have lots of minions to help him.
Does anyone know if Berryfields was picked because its on a lay-line?
Nothing would surprise me about the Â鶹¹ÙÍøÊ×Ò³Èë¿Ú!
Derek Pig -
Message 21
Posted by helenmj66 (U2451387) on Thursday, 3rd May 2007
I get the impression from reading the headgardener at Berryfield's blog that they film at least two weeks in advance.
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Message 22
Posted by Lilypicker (U8223215) on Friday, 4th May 2007
It has been widely reported that hawthorn was a whole month early this year but nearly all those reports were people mistaking blackthorn for hawthorn - very common mistake, even in the country. In mid-Kent the hawthorn was generally coming out last weekend, which is about a week early as we often don't have mayflowers for May Day here (whereas they do in London for example). I got very cross with the bbc website which actually printed a picture from a punter of "unseasonal blossom" - it was obviously blackthorn or some other early prunus, definitely not hawthorn! So it's early but not THAT early.
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Message 23
Posted by hounded (U7956325) on Friday, 4th May 2007
look we have been over this KEW, you know the well known Botanical studies center, confirmed that Hawthorn was in flower 1 month early ,yes Hawthorn very very postive!
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Message 24
Posted by CycadPariah (U8165600) on Sunday, 6th May 2007
Sorry to confuse you Derek...just checking you were paying attention!
I think Berryfields may have been built apon an ancient burial site, producing evil spirits that haunt the site affecting plant growth and casting it in a constant shadow each day. That would certainly explain the standard of horticulture and the weekly appirition of Monty Don, and his fellow spirits.
i think it was beelzebub that chose the site doing so through an unsuspecting Â鶹¹ÙÍøÊ×Ò³Èë¿Ú producer.
I believe the evil one is using Berryfields as a vehicle to spread his word.
Fear Monty Don!!! -
Message 25
Posted by hounded (U7956325) on Sunday, 6th May 2007
yes this would explain a lot. the place is evil cursed, plants come up the wrong colour the wrong type in the wrong place, ponds drain themselves and presenters vanish, I fool that I am had put it down to the incompetence of the head gardner and his minions.But no its Monty, no doubt he has used the other presenters as human sacrifice, and each week try's to make us all kill ourselves though boredom, as part of his evil plan to bore the world to death for the devil.
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Message 26
Posted by TallyHo (U2364821) on Tuesday, 8th May 2007
In mid-Kent the hawthorn was generally coming out last weekend, which is about a week early as we often don't have mayflowers for May Day hereÂ
The confusion over may blossom can arise because in the 17thC, the calender was changed. May 11th became May 1st, our present May Day's actually earlier than it used to be, so if hawthorn's blooming during the first week of May, it's about a week earlier. -
Message 27
Posted by U8157043 (U8157043) on Tuesday, 8th May 2007
I really like Monty, hes unprentious and calming. Considering he has to live with a sometimes debilitating illness, does really well. I admired him in the programme where he worked with youth offenders.... Monty some of us LOVE YOU!.Keep up the good work and keep on smilin.
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Message 28
Posted by Jenks812 (U5452843) on Tuesday, 8th May 2007
i completely agree seapoppypink.
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Message 29
Posted by auricula (U3244275) on Tuesday, 8th May 2007
unpretentious ??!!??..hmmm....
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Message 30
Posted by hounded (U7956325) on Tuesday, 8th May 2007
Hello seapoppypink , his young offenders problem solving show was toe curling to watch, as he has simply no comprehension of the lives of these people, this was typical do gooder rubish. the people taking part mostly took it as a chance to be on TV with out having to go to the trouble of going on big brother or pop idol, and to give them kudose with there low life mates. And no matter what his private life is, I think as a garden designer he lacks vision and talent, as his endless tinkering with the beds shows, nothing gets more than a year, before it is ripped up as it is "not working". His delivery is slow flat and dull. He should be given a spot on veg in the show, but as the head gardener of the show he is rubbish
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Message 31
Posted by real_monty (U7742669) on Tuesday, 8th May 2007
Dear kfgray,
Whilst I uphold your right to any opinion that you chose to hold about Gardener's World or my role in it and the freedom to express it on these pages - I must correct you about one thing: you say that: "the people taking part mostly took it as a chance to be on TV with out having to go to the trouble of going on big brother or pop idol, and to give them kudose with there low life mates. " This is simply not true. All those taking part were persistant prolific offenders sentenced to a court order. They took part in the project as part of that order. Whilst no one was physically forced to attend, non attendance had to be renegotiated with the probation service and the court.
It may be that you have a much greater knowledge and understanding than I do of the problems that addiction and the process of crime that addicts get drawn into to finance their habits. In this case I would be extremely glad if you wished to help us. We have a website - themontyproject.com - and the charity is looking for money and expertise from any quarter to enable us to continue the work - without cameras or publicity but hopefully doing some good.
I wish you well
Monty Don -
Message 32
Posted by cazsudz (U7061972) on Tuesday, 8th May 2007
Hi kfgray
Re; Growing out of trouble
Sorry, whatever you think of MD as Gardener's World presenter, I think to write the people who took part in the programme off like this is not on and just the sort of attitude that the programme was trying to take a stand against. -
Message 33
Posted by cazsudz (U7061972) on Tuesday, 8th May 2007
Oh good , Monty got there before me and said what I was thinking in a much more reasonable way
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Message 34
Posted by U8157043 (U8157043) on Wednesday, 9th May 2007
Whoops, I spelt unprententious incorrectly!! sorry auricula!
kfgray...
well, your comments were a little below the belt towards Monty and the youth offenders. I myself having lived a rather sheltered life have no idea what it is like to be reliant on drugs and crime, and obviously do not agree with it but you see were back to the old thing "If your mad, bad or different" your ALWAYS gonna be the butt of the majority. I wonder have you any knowledge or expertese in this field..mmmmmmmmmm I wonder I doubt.I dont think it it shows strength of character to call our fellow "humans" low lifes, whatever their status is, maybe it has more to do with the accuser. -
Message 35
Posted by Jenks812 (U5452843) on Wednesday, 9th May 2007
that a boy Monty.
Good to see you still checking in on these pages.
And although kfgray has a right to express his opinion on your aspect of GW, I will express mine to say that you're brilliant as head gardener for GW and in my opinion the best there's been. I don't imagine you're the sort to change their ways to others' opinions, so just keep up the good work and possibly move GW to your own wonderful garden? -
Message 36
Posted by Devonian Fossil (U7800494) on Wednesday, 9th May 2007
Just to add my twopennorth, I thought that Growing Out of Trouble was a brilliant programme. If only one of the offenders has managed to turn their life around due to this project, it makes it all worth while. I have a son who has been in trouble with substance abuse and with the law on several occasions, and having helped on projects such as this as part of his various court orders, he is now beginning to have respect for himself and for others and I am so proud of him.
Long may the project continue. -
Message 37
Posted by TallyHo (U2364821) on Wednesday, 9th May 2007
Well said Jenks… I agree with every word.
kfgray, you're becoming a tad boring yourself. Every topic is slanted to serve your personal vendetta and I suggest you either write to the Â鶹¹ÙÍøÊ×Ò³Èë¿Ú or MD himself with your complaints. I'm sure he's more than capable of addressing them, as he has done just now, note: not on his own behalf, but on those his charity has helped and hopes to help in future. -
Message 38
Posted by auricula (U3244275) on Wednesday, 9th May 2007
Monty - I'm glad the project is continuing and hope it does more good.I'll definitely check out the website.
I taught in a disadvantaged area for years and know of at least 2 cases where children as young as 6yrs old helped their parents to inject or held the spoon when drugs were heated up - so any scheme to help to combat drug abuse needs all the support it can get. -
Message 39
Posted by auricula (U3244275) on Wednesday, 9th May 2007
P.S. to Monty
Could you not consider transferring GW to your own garden - I'm sure that ownership of the garden is what the programme lacks? -
Message 40
Posted by groovygran (U2934690) on Wednesday, 9th May 2007
Like you auricula - I taught in a disadvantaged area for years. The social workers were constant visitors to school, becos of poor home situations. Out of many cases, I had a 6yr old girl whose mother was giving the child drugs just for the effect it had on her, and I had to keep a daily diary as to her physical appearance and reactions WHEN she came to school. Wow! Could I write a book!
More power to the likes of Monty, it's such a hard job even getting beneath the surface and to prove it even goes on. Sorry, kfgray, you were strictly out of order! -
Message 41
Posted by auricula (U3244275) on Wednesday, 9th May 2007
Hi Poppyred
Heartbreaking isn't it? As deputy and acting head I had more dealings with police and social workers than I did with educationalists, so I agree that anything Monty or any other "personality" can do to highlight these terrible problems needs to be applauded -
Message 42
Posted by hounded (U7956325) on Wednesday, 9th May 2007
Dear mr Dom First credit for reading these pages, and being willing to write a reply , and this is also for poppys pink and red and mr fossil and all the others who have lept to Mr Dons defence. my answer is as Follows. Yes I do have experiance with drug addicts. I have 2 brothers or should I say had, who both were drug addicts. for 5 years I watched them lie steal cheat my family out of every thing cash/jewels you name it, it drove my mother to an early grave. over those 5 years we gave all the love kindness we could muster, and paid for rehab time after time. My youngest brother OD and died if a pool of his own vomit. the other one died of HIV a few years later. The final clinic said something we found out the the hard way NO ONE CAN SAVE THEM TILL THEY SAVE THEMSELVES. The money spent on this entertainment TV could have been spent so much better cleaning up a sink estates or a youth programe to get the kids of the streeet and away from the dealers. All Junkies sell no matter what they say, it is how they pay there habit they recruit the next generation.So i consider them low lifes As to the maxim "if you save one" thats what they said about the Titanic, it was still a disaster. I pointed out that Mr Don should have a Veg programme he is very good and belive that is where is true passion is centered.I am sure he is a top fellow with skill and passion. My reservation is I feel that as he is not the person to have a long term plan and vision for the programme and the garden and to enthuse viewers ,and I am far from the only one. as for always harping on about the same thing(Mr Don) if you read allotment tales I hope I have offerd lots of good advice to many people on Veg and flowers pest etc.
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Message 43
Posted by real_monty (U7742669) on Wednesday, 9th May 2007
I am so sorry to hear about your brothers - although it is a story that I have heard only too often. It is a terrible, awful waste.
In fact I agree with you entirely. Addicts cannot be helped in any way until and unless they decide to stop using. Everything else is a waste of time. But at that point I believe that they can benefit a very great deal from support, training and encouragement. However there are no easy answers and I hope that our programme did not give that impression.
As for the money in making the programme - none of it went towards the project and if the production costs raised awareness of the scale of the problem then it has been wisely spent.
I am sorry that GW is not panning out exactly as you would like it but then whoever headed the programme would do well to please some of the people some of the time.
Good gardening
Monty -
Message 44
Posted by TallyHo (U2364821) on Wednesday, 9th May 2007
kfgray with the background you've documented I now understand and can sympathize with the embittered nature of your posts. I too have lost friends to drug abuse and can see why you feel that it is futile to offer any alternative to the lifestyle they've either chosen or fallen into.
However, two negatives will never make a positive. The people on Monty's project _were_ kept off the streets (and out of jail, where drug use is endemic and costs the public purse far more) more importantly, by growing food, they've given a sense of achievement and self-sufficiency that will be the springboard to 'save themselves'. Other re-hab programmes don't address this self-worth thing and consist of sitting in a circle whingeing to each other about their problems. Not inspiring.
As most of your contributions on these boards have come laced with a personal attack on the hapless MD, I tend to disregard them. He doesn't float your boat, but I can tell you that there are thousands of people, myself included, who've been inspired and informed by him over many years, and, as I've said, your obsessive vendetta against the man has become even more tedious than you consider him to be. If you don't have anything positive to say, go outside and do some potting on or something. -
Message 45
Posted by michelle78 (U7007319) on Wednesday, 9th May 2007
Thank goodness Monty managed to get a reply to you first, kfgray. While everyone has a right to an opinion (even on these moderated boards!), I find your comments illustrate that lack of understanding that you accuse Monty of. If your tirade wasn't actually just a stream of abuse towards a TV presenter (come on, get a real cause to get angry about!) and you do have some morals, I hope you do something to help these people you claim to have such superior knowledge of.
Well done Monty for such an eloquent response.
Mich -
Message 46
Posted by michelle78 (U7007319) on Wednesday, 9th May 2007
Apologies kfgray, only just read your post about your brothers. I'm sorry to hear about that, drug abuse is no happy ending story for the majority, and i have lost far too many friends to them so have some empathy for what you and your family have gone through.
However, I still have to disagree with you about Monty. I actually like the constant rearrangement of borders and the fact that they are not ashamed to admit some things work and some things don't. This is real gardening in real life! And I don't find him dull and lifeless in the slightless.
Mich -
Message 47
Posted by hounded (U7956325) on Wednesday, 9th May 2007
Hello TallyHo and Michelle78 , first thanks to Monty don for getting back to me. The point I made about saving themselves was that the people on the TV, as Mr Don said where there because the court made them do it, it was that or something much more unpleasent. So they took the nice and easier route with a well meaning nice fellow. I think if we had not always been so easy on my brothers and always making allowence ,I think they would most likly be alive today. And TallyHo please, Obsessive vendetta. What about the little spat "April fool" and you derick pig and sid and warrior, what is it over two hundred postings. I post one posting (who picked Berryfields) a simple question, made one comment about Mr Don. I have one more posting on the page, its about seeking advice for feeding Clematis and do's not mention Mr Don. Any other comments regarding Mr Don have been in answer to other peoples Q and A either to disagree or agree, As in Auriculas posting on who will host Chelsea, poor women was to afraid even to mention his name in case the thought police should swoop.As for Michelle78 yes I do think I have some direct understandings of drug addiction, I hope you never have to watch the people you love die a little bit every day in front of you.
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Message 48
Posted by Jenks812 (U5452843) on Thursday, 10th May 2007
I'm not so sure kfgray has a "vendetta" against Monty. As we've said before we're all intitled to our opinions, and that's great for lively debate. If everyone liked Monty, I wouldn't get the chance to stick up for him, which I enjoy.
But kfgray, in reference to auricula's post, far from being a "poor woman" I've found auricula to be a very strong and opinionated poster. I found her post to be a little tongue in cheek. Which I quite enjoy. As always we disagree about Monty but she's always up for the debate. Plus, if I remember correctly, she used to live in Colchester, which she make her as tough as old boots.
Keep up the debates! -
Message 49
Posted by U8157043 (U8157043) on Thursday, 10th May 2007
I think Ive opened a little can of worms here (worms are good for the garden!!!), so if its ok Ill address,kfgray...........
Hello kfgray.Whilst I am very sorry for your brothers invovement in drugs which led to their tragic deaths,I too have had tragedy, but what i try and do is look at things objectively rather than subjectively. It doesnt always work but its good to at least try, sometimes things look a little differnt. So Montys programme whilst you maybe thought it quote "toe curling" unquote, bought about debate and "put out" these things happen and........maybe........ give a differnt perspective of the youths invoved, given the chance. To try and "save" someone from their own hands and minds is surely better than to just leave them in the gutter.You say Monty is a "do gooder", but I think he has more about him than that, and is just highlighting something that needs addressing.
My own opinion is that constructive criticism is good, personal attacks are not, they are just hurtful, just re-jig the vocab a bit and maybe be more polite. -
Message 50
Posted by U8157043 (U8157043) on Thursday, 10th May 2007
P.s......... kfgray
Whilst its easy to sit and hide behind a computer to express ones own opinion, at least you have an honesty and do not give someone a "slating" and then say "oh its all tongue in cheek". To me that is worse, and irritates me to the enth.
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