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The philosopher Slavoj Zizek is in extended conversation with Philip Dodd, discussing his new book Against the Double Blackmail: Refugees, Terror and Other Troubles with the Neighbours, in which he argues that Europeans are caught between (on the one hand) guilt at the suffering of migrants or (on the other) a determination to defend their way of life against a perceived threat. He suggests that alternatives are available - but that they require Europeans to make fundamental changes to their world view.